High Reps

[kenpopaul]

Hi All,

I went to a friends funeral yesterday afterwards a group of us started talking about training. My friend who died was a doorman & semi pro bodybuilder so you can imagine the size of some people at the funeral (I've never seen so many huge, hard looking people in one room before!! Out of the 200 or so people there at least 200 were either big, ripped or just mean looking - yet such nice people!).

Anyway, I was talking to another friend of mine, who again is a bodybuilder. I said to him that he looked bigger than ever and he told me about how he has totally changed his training. For years he has done the usual 'Heavy' lifting, but this year he has changed it to very light weights but super high reps. Instead of the usual 8-12 reps he now does 75-100 reps per set. His reasoning, the more blood he get's into his muscles, the more nutrients, protein etc is delivered into the muscles.

I started telling him about the techniques I use (DVR's, isometrics etc) and he said he's also been doing them too. It's obviously working for him as it is us. It made a refreshing change to the usual 'Gym talk'.

Thought I'd share that with you all.

Kenpopaul

[ben alexander]

I remember reading about how Frank Zane, one of the most aethetically pleasing bodybuilders on the 70s, has now begun to use less weight and higher reps. He mentioned that he wished he'd done something similar years ago, as years of shoulder injuries and heavy weight haven't been very good for him.

Ben

[kelbiz]

kenpopaul;

Sorry about your friend.
Interesting on how the change of lifting strategy made a difference with your high-rep friend. Similar to doing high-rep Power Cals or DSR's. Still, many don't believe until they give it a try. For many, the heavy weights are their security blanket.
Isn't it amazing the things we discuss at funerals?

Jack

[kenpopaul]

Yeah Jack, it'll be interesting to see if my friend sticks to the High Rep thing. The main reason for him changing to it was due to too many injuries.

he's even 'converted' another one of his friends to High rep training and he said his body has changed dramatically in the last few weeks!!

maybe one day I can get my firend on a 'no weights' workout :)

[JoeJustice]

Sorry to hear about the death of your friend, Paul. You know, it's sad but sometimes it seems like the only times we really get to sit down and talk with friends and family is at funerals. Maybe that's because all of the "defense" are down at events like that.

Anyhow... If you look back, I high reps were very, very common. This whole 10-12 rep thing I think is just typical, bodybuilding dogma. At the very lease, people just mix it up a bit!

-Joe

[MikeNY]

Sorry about your friend.

Greg has an interesting thread on ultra slow VRT that seems to go to hit on a point that John uses in DVR. Tell your buddy about VRT it might be literaly a God send for weight lifters.

[xlionhearted82x]

Paul,

Sorry for your loss brother.

Yes indeed, sometimes shaking things up a bit can change the world. But wow, 75-100 reps per set? How long a training session is extended then? I guess he's not doing so many multiple sets...

[kenpopaul]

I'll have to find out more from my friend regarding his sets. I'm glad I'm only doing 1 HIT set per exercise. I'd rather spend my time doing other things :)

[Royce]

Hi All,

I went to a friends funeral yesterday afterwards a group of us started talking about training. My friend who died was a doorman & semi pro bodybuilder so you can imagine the size of some people at the funeral (I've never seen so many huge, hard looking people in one room before!! Out of the 200 or so people there at least 200 were either big, ripped or just mean looking - yet such nice people!).

Anyway, I was talking to another friend of mine, who again is a bodybuilder. I said to him that he looked bigger than ever and he told me about how he has totally changed his training. For years he has done the usual 'Heavy' lifting, but this year he has changed it to very light weights but super high reps. Instead of the usual 8-12 reps he now does 75-100 reps per set. His reasoning, the more blood he get's into his muscles, the more nutrients, protein etc is delivered into the muscles.

I started telling him about the techniques I use (DVR's, isometrics etc) and he said he's also been doing them too. It's obviously working for him as it is us. It made a refreshing change to the usual 'Gym talk'.

Thought I'd share that with you all.

Kenpopaul
Hit or volume
Ken,

Please understand that the HIT—high intensity training—isn’t high rep training. I’m not sure that I have made myself clear about that matter.

I’m all for self resistance training, which can be tailored to either a high volume or high intensity regimen. But you can’t do both at once.

People have had great success with both types of training. So I tell people to do what works for them.

[gruntbrain]

Accommodating resistance that is involved in Transformetric exercizes allows one to perform "unlimited" reps. As usual, experimentation will determine how to apply intensities given your goals

[kenpopaul]

Hey Royce,

It's okay I'm not doing high rep training, I was just saying what my friend has been doing lately. Thought it'd make an interesting post that's all.

I'm starting your HIT workout as written, that is 1 set 10 reps super high tension (Like the Mentzer style workouts I used to do a few years ago).

I've always responded better to Low rep, high intensity training, I know it's the other way around for others.

Thanks for the message though Royce :)

Kenpopaul

[Andy62]

It's called "endurance strength" and the oldtime strongmen trained for it by doing extremely high reps to develop this ability. Even when doing weight training they used light weights and extremely high reps [50 or more], Of course wrestling and boxing matches of their era lasted for hours and a hundred or more rounds.

[Bruno]

Sorry for your loss.

After your post there was some anecdotal evidence of what has worked and some references to scientific training. Alot of exercise physiologists and scientists have tried to determine what causes muscle to grow and it seems that to a certain extant individuals respond to different stimuli for better or worse.

Some "grow" more with higher reps; others with density volume (reducing rest between sets); others still with low reps and high tension. Scientists and exercise buffs have debated volume and HIT since Arthur Jones first proposed the method and as it was later modified by Menzter.

I think that a muscle needs consistent progressive resistance. A muscle has to be stressed to grow stronger and larger. imho reps and sets should be varied every six or 12 weeks or so.

The stress can be induced by a number of different methods and programs. High volume or low rep high tension. A person should not blindly follow a rep scheme. High reps for one individual may be 12 or 20 reps.

I do high tension low rep dvr and 3 sets of 50 push ups with ipf daily sometimes for a longer period of time, sometimes for just five minutes. I presently mix and match, on this routine since October. I will take through the end of the year and then shift focus again.

The high volume can seduce a person because the muscles may grow. However, I believe that the "look" will be that of a pumper-soft and bloated. I think that push ups and pulls build density to a muscle and provide real muscle growth as opposed to a soft pumped look.

Look at power lifters or olympic lifters Not bodybuilders that view their bodies as a collection of bodyparts. power lifters and olympic lifters lift in an integrated fashion with compound movements. power lifters and oly lifters have a hard muscular look. To me much more appealing than a present day Mr. Olympia. I mention power lifters and oly because they usually use heavy weight and low reps which if you extend the analogy to this forum would be low rep high tension.
Power lifters train three lifts- bench, deadlift and squat most throw in overhead press as an auxiliary lift. Here we can perform low rep high tension push ups, say a slow 30 to 60 second push up, high tension bw squat similar to the Miracle 7 squat only low rep and deeper, we can perform vrt deadlifts and handstand push ups. Effectively, we can create a fantastic physique without weights.

Transformetric students also can exercise in an integrated fashion with pull ups, push ups, handstand presses, plank, bridges, bw squats etc. Those exercises even perfomed in low reps with high tension will build a much better build imho than 75 to 100 reps of whatever the pumpers will perform.

I could see one set done to failure/near failure of any given exercise (b/t/w/ is what most current HIT use-one set to failure of one exercise for one body part) but not multiple sets at 75 to 100 reps.

[gruntbrain]

As an aside, combat athletes rrain for strength endurance. Although I'm not a combat dude & such training is not optimal for pure strength, it is nonetheless worth consideration

[tony84]

I just read an article online, i think it was called, high reps build muscle big time. It was about a study done in Japan about very high rep weight training. The study found that high rep training releases more growth hormone then heavy/low rep training. It didnt really go into any detail tho, so it was a little disappointing. I bet if it wasnt for the macho factor of weightlifting and guys wanting to brag about how much they can bench, a lot of more people would lift light.

Tony

[mts]

That's a very cool idea.

[marktb]

If you look at the old-time bb's,they had tremendous ab muscles. Small waists but very large upper bodies. Today's bb's are much less aesthetic. The old-timers I don't think did any aerobic exercise to burn fat, but yet had very little abdominal bodyfat. Zabo reportedly did thousands of repetitions in ab exercises to attain his incredible ab definition.

Charlie Francis, the former strength coach for Ben JOhnson and Olympic track coach, has his athletes so crunches in sets of 100 to hit the deep muscle fibers responsible for "holdiing the body in place" and postural tone.

I will soon post pics reflecting my recent training methods. This 40 year old is trying

Mark