Atlas Sit-Up and the Back

[VRT Man]

Lately, as I've mentioned to others, I've added Atlas III push-ups and Atlas sit-ups to my VRT / M7 Hybrid (I constantly mix things up to create muscle confusion and thus exacerbate any anabolic growth), and I've found a solution to any and all back problems that I've had.

John has mentioned vertebral elongation exercises (literally stretching the spine) to alleviate back pain. Well, my version of Atlas sit-ups, (and I admit right up front that I cannot get my face down to my knees, but I do get close), has alleviated Sciatia that I've been troubled with since about age 51 (6 years ago).

I do the Atlas sit-up, and imagine that I am seated and rowing in an ancient Trireme or Bireme (an old Phoenician, Greek, or Roman ship), and I am under tension as I thrust my arms forward as far as possible, and pull back to lying back down, under tension, of pulling back on my imaginary oar. Row forward, pull back on the oar, all under extreme muscular tension. Then off to the side, both sides. (Watch Charleton Heston in the scene in "Ben Hur," in which he and other slaves are rowing a Roman galley.)

The sciatica I had is now only a memory. This is going on several months. I can dance like a 20 year old (in fact, did so with my wife at a local nightclub where her brother does a Las Vegas style act with karaoke, jokes, etc.), and find that "father time" is on a big delay. With me at least.

Try this if you've had back problems.

Greg Mangan
VRT Man

[JoeJustice]

Greg, have you tried the full range leg raises? Where you go from laying flat to touching your toes behind your head? A lot of people have a real hard time with this move, but I think it's even better than the Atlas Sit-Up for stretching the back.

In gymnastics class they do a similar move called "Rolly Pollies" where you lock your hands out out over your head while doing the movement. It makes it tougher, there aren't many in the class that can do it full range. Lucky for me, I have a great deal of flexibility.

When I was doing high rep Tiger Stretch Push-Ups, I followed each set with full range leg lifts. Without doing this my lower back would ache the next day. So add those in now and then and see if they don't help out a bit.

-Joe

[tom]

The other day I woke up and did Atlas Sit Ups from where I lay. I sleep on a thin mat. My feet weren't perfect in the beginning as far as staying on the floor. Everything was slow and deliberate.

I got to 50, got bored, and quit. My stomach wasn't feeling much.

First, my stomach is always pretty strong, has been for a long time, so not getting tired doesn't surprise me. Still, I want to see someone do it correctly. I have seen still pictures. I need motion.

Video anyone?

Greg? I mean Other Greg.

Tom

[MikeNY]

Greg very interesting result of that streching! Atlas Exercises are streching people like Yoga, Gordon has a point about American Yoga.

PS Greg that sounds like an interesting and differnt workout, mixing the M7 and VRT; I keep them seperate and hope to be doing both soon.

[tom]

Wow. I haven't thought about it. I guess I've been sleeping on the floor twenty-four years now. There are/were no particular reasons other than convenience and expense along with circumstances, surroundings, and culture. The times I've traveled and slept in a bed didn't seem to make any difference.

I don't recommend nor recomnot it.

Tom

[MikeNY]

Tom; was once told that monks that sleep on wooden boards (with a blanket, mat or rug as a mattress) never get bad backs; might have been Cistercian Monks or Trappists. You might be onto something.

Idea: Tom's Monk bed's low price, lower back pain relieved. :dazed:

[Greg Newton]

Hey Greg,

That was very creative on the rowing motion. I had to do something similar when I first started doing the Atlas situps. But, as I got stronger and the waist got smaller, they got easier and I began to put my hands at my ears like recoomended by Jim Forystek. I touch my elbows to my knees and slightly lower, but I am not able to touch my nose to my knees yet.

This has been a very beneficial exercise for my lower spine and hip; which were heading me for some serious disability due to some serious disk deterioration. However, as John explained to me, deterioration and compression were the same thing. The key is curling the spine as you sit up and not trying to sit straight up. As Joe mentioned, the full range Atlas leg raise is also excellent for decompressing the spine, but it is still uncomfortable for me at this time because of a hietal hernia.

And Tom, that is a pretty good idea about doing a video of Atlas situps. Right now though, I am working on a 100 Atlas pushups video as time permits. I have a lot of admiration for Joe in how well he does his videos. It is hard getting the right camera angles, lighting and performance to click all at the same time.

[monty]

been doing atlas III for a few weeks-50-100 5 days a week and my waist is smaller and more defined.
Great stuff!!
Monty

[monty]

Woops Atlas III situps. Sorry.

[JoeJustice]

Video anyone?


Don't mine if I do.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/_ZwK9aAe49s&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/_ZwK9aAe49s&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Not up to my usual production standards, but I think I got all the info in there. Just for you, Tom, muh brothah. If you can do 50 and get bored, more power to ya!

-Joe

[GB]

Greg,

Great post I’m sure that your testimonial will encourage others to experiment.

GB

[tom]

Thanks, Joe. It answered my question of pace and form. I'm about the same in form, my legs also come slightly off the floor but that will get better. My pace was much, much slower. I was trying to keep my form perfect, no momentum, locked knees, keep those dang heels on the floor, no jerking, throwing the hands or elbows forward, etc. It was harder in a frustration way, but no burn. Your pace will have me dealing with lactic burn.

Your video quick quality is better than most of the quality on youtube, so thanks.

The raises were also at a faster pace, much more fun. I was doing them real slow also, which cuts down on one's perceived flexibility. I appear much more flexibility with a little ballisticity thrown in.

I don't lock my fingers, for the reason you gave. I either touch my ears or reach back over my shoulders. On the sit-up I don't ever think going up, but rolling forward, like rolling up a sleeping bag.

I would say you are now on the high end of your age group (almost 30) in strength, coordination, and flexibility. And maybe you're tops of all cartoonists. Keep it up.

Greg(s), now that we're looking at something, what do you do/see?

Tom

[JoeJustice]

Yeah, I tend to like to move as fast as I can while maintaining control. From time to time I'll do slow and super slow version of exercises, but I think moving fast (again while still in control) builds coordination.

Your heels will probably come up a bit and the more fatigued your are, the more your heels will come up, at least they do for me. I didn't this video right after I got home from my gymnastics class and was already totally whipped out. I tired a tuck last night and landed directly on my head, my neck is killing me today!! :excruciating:

The main reason I lock my hands behind my head is it forces me to do the exercise properly. Notice in my video the way I do a crunching movement first, head towards the ceiling and then curling forward. If you focus on NOT pulling your head with your hands then it forces that initial crunching movement to get your head off the ground. Put you hands behind your head, look straight up and do the sit-up while your hands are relaxed behind your head. The second you feel your hands pulling, you know you're not crunching.

At least that's how I do it. I'm be curious to know what others do.


Your video quick quality is better than most of the quality on youtube, so thanks.


You know, I really don't like doing that "talk into the camera" demos. I think they're on the boring side (no offense to people who do that and/or enjoy watching them) I'd rather have entertaining elements mixed throughout.


And maybe you're tops of all cartoonists. Keep it up.


You seem to know my industry very well... :tongue:

-Joe

[Viking Dan]

You do Atlas Sit Ups with legs apart? Interesting. I always had my knees together. That's how it appeared to me in John's books and the Atlas course.

[Greg Newton]

Good flexibility Joe. Could you have done that when you first started this style of exercise?

Greg III

[tom]

Greg N, what is your pace? How long does it take to do your set?

Yeah, again, that's good flexibility.

As for legs apart, something I learned from Pavel was that leg raises, V-ups, bicycles, etc. are harder for the abs with toes straight up and knees squeezed together. I'm too lazy right now to get on the floor and check it out with Atlas Sit-ups.

Tom

[JoeJustice]

You do Atlas Sit Ups with legs apart? Interesting. I always had my knees together. That's how it appeared to me in John's books and the Atlas course.

Hey, you're right... I never really noticed that before. I have no idea where or why I started doing them with my legs apart.

Greg, I could do the Atlas Sit-Up from day 1 (but not very many), I don't know what mechanism enabled that. I always thought it was odd that people had a hard time with that move because it came naturally to me. But the full range leg raise came latter when I had been practicing Yoga for a little while and was able to hold the Plow pose.

Anyone else think it's weird we have 3 Gregs and only one Joe?

-Joe

[jlee]

Great demo Joe. I do the sit-ups with legs close together, not together though. On the Atlas leg raise I am not touching feet behind my head on a regular basis but get my thighs close to my head. I suffer from a crushed disc and have other back issues as well. I was afraid to do both movements at first but was encouraged by Greg Newtons posts. They have really helped me.

- Joe (too)

[jonlclay]

Joe,

Great video, it seems like you are very limber, the Atlas Leg Raises you seem to just fold over and it looks so easy for you. I on the other hand struggle mightily with this exercise. Atlas Situps are so bad but I cannot get the range of motion yet. Someday.

Greg,

I too have lower back issues so will try your form to see how it goes. Thanks for the idea.

Jon

[tom]

I mentioned that I sleep on a thin pad on the floor and can open my eyes in the morning and do sit ups right there. There were some question about that - it's just something I do for no particular reason or benefit - but here's an old song that should clear it all up. It's about floor sleeping and toxic relationships. Floor sleeping - good. That other thing - stay away from it.

I don't know how to make that cool youtube box appear:

[editted: now I do. Thanks, Joe.]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIVzd9aR8kU

Tom

[JoeJustice]

I don't know how to make that cool youtube box appear:


Tom, you disabled embedding on your YouTube video. You can't create a YouTube box without the embedding option turned on.

-Joe

[tom]

Thanks. Much cooler.

I did 50 sit-ups this morning before I got up at the faster pace. First, I didn't get as bored. Second, I could see there would be a lactic burn to deal with eventually.

Straight away, with no warm up, the legs want to move more.

Tom

[JoeJustice]

Thanks. Much cooler.


http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss57/D14A4Guy/A_Tip_of_the_Hat_by_jollyjack.jpg

[Greg Newton]

Greg N, what is your pace? How long does it take to do your set?

Tom,

It takes me about 3.5 minutes to do 75. I am working on the speed. I do them continuous, but not at the pace I thought I was.

Greg N.

[tom]

Thanks, Greg, that's much more of a clip than I had thought. I did it yesterday in a little over four. Trying to keep my feet down and the whole thing as smooth as possible slows me down, not fatigue. I'll work on the feet.

Tom

[Aaron Hoot]

Thanks to Greg Mangan for the suggestion about acting like you are on an old ship rowing when you do your situps. My son Ben is having some trouble with his and a little back pain. I will have him try them tomorrow.

Aaron

[VRT Man]

Just wanted to say I've increased my stamina on this particular exercise. I have now completed 100 reps of this 'rowing Atlas sit-up', which I perform before the beginning of my Iso/VRT/M7 workout. My back and abs never felt better. And my ship is moving along at a good, fast clip through the Mediterranean.

--Greg Mangan

[BIGAPPLEMUSCLE]

Hi,
I am not familiar with the Atlas situp. Any links that can be put on line showing it being done? How many levels of the situp were there?
Thanks

[firefox]

Tom,

You're not feeling much in the abs with Atlas Sit-ups because on the way up, when your torso goes past 45 degrees, your hip flexors,which are taking over,tire before the abs are really worked. I never understood why the Atlas Sit-ups are considered a great ab exercise.I mean, I think that it's an excellent exercise for functional core strenth and stretching the spine;but,for hitting the abs with the most intensity,I think that the ab wheel,Russian Twist(holding the torso at 30 degrees and twisting from side to side),and bent legged sit-ups done slowly up to 30 degrees and down do a better job. Anyway,variety is good.