[MikeNY]

The US has had a mixed Socialist/Capitalistic Economy for a long time. Here in New York we get European Taxes that might break usury law's without any of the benifits that European's get. We have had Democratic rule for over the past two years and Pelosi and Reid calling the shots in the USA, people sniping and making jokes about Bush and now the Shortbus president is the real Ruler, being both Chief Executive and running his Party.

The Market does not like the lack of focus and disciplne Shortbus has brought to Washington, his Stimulus Plan is mostly Pork and little Stimulus.

I've called my Congressman and Senators recommending several things.

1. Let Business write off capital expenditure in the year the money is spent, and abate taxes, let them use losses and capital spent immediatly without limit. The result would be they invest in production and plant with people being hired.

2. People do not like the idea of others getting a free ride on mortgages while 93% to 94% of Americans pay thier mortgage on time. Let those people in trouble use Ethical Lender's as highlighted by ABC News http://abcnews.go.com/Business/Econo...6934151&page=1 and those that were flipping properties let them fail. Give 30, 40 and 50 year Mortgages to those that need lowered payments, don't pay off thier principle and force the rest of us to pay. The Government can also use the Treasury to bring about 4% Mortgages, that alone will save some barrowers, increase home purchases and lower payments for all Americans.

3. Don't raise taxes in a recession as Shortbus plans. The usual result is a deeper recession.

[Alan_OldStudent]

Originally Posted by Free

It is always amazing to me when the Socialists blame Capitalism for the current crisis, when the socialism implemented over the last decades, and before, is obviously the cause. We have been moving away from Capitalism for a long, long, time now, and to pretend otherwise is pretty ridiculous.

Can't wait for the Obamies to be out of work.

Hi Free,

In your opinion, what were those socialist measures "implemented over the last decades" that caused this crisis?

Regards,

Alan

[Alan_OldStudent]

Originally Posted by MikeNY

....We have had Democratic rule for over the past two years and Pelosi and Reid calling the shots in the USA, people sniping and making jokes about Bush and now the Shortbus president is the real Ruler, being both Chief Executive and running his Party.....

Hi Mike,

Forgive me, but Shortbus????

Why Shortbus?

I don't get it.


Regards,

Alan OldStudent

[Free]

Originally Posted by Alan_OldStudent

Hi Free,

In your opinion, what were those socialist measures "implemented over the last decades" that caused this crisis?

Regards,

Alan

The Socialists measures implemented in the last decades and before are:

Progressive Taxation
Welfare Programs
Regulation and general Gov intervention and interference

Particularly in the last decades, the CRA and the machinations of Acorn, Obama, and Barney Frank, caused the crash of the real estate market, and much of our current situation.

[MikeNY]

Alan the term "Shortbus President" was a term of endearment that Liberals Voters used for former President Bush from about 2004 onwards. The term Shortbus comes from the small buses used for those student with a developmental disability, the term was once "retarded". Here is a snip i took off of Wikipedia "The term "mental retardation" is a diagnostic term designed to capture and standardize a group of disconnected categories of mental functioning such as "idiot", "imbecile", and "moron" derived from early IQ tests, which acquired pejorative connotations in popular discourse over time. The term "mental retardation" has itself now acquired some pejorative and shameful connotations over the last few decades due to the use of "retarded" as an insult. This may in turn have contributed to its replacement with expressions such as "mentally challenged" or "intellectual disability"."

Since former President Bush reportedly had a higher IQ than President Obama; I thought the term was useful to describe Obama and also fitting.

[MikeNY]

Free it is interesting that ACORN is not one of the Ethical Lender's, they made Billions, maybe hundred's of Billions of Dollars Bundiling Subprime Loans for greedy Wall Street. ACORN really set up poor minority barrowers and made tons of money off the suffering of the poor.

[gruntbrain]

Lotsa of folks from all political persuasions were inspired by the movie Wallstreet( greed is good) & over levered loans . I'm not totally buying the notion that lenders were forced into making wildly over levered loans; GREED is a grat motivator

[Alan_OldStudent]

Hi Free,

In answer to my request for clarification of your position, you wrote:

Originally Posted by Free

The Socialists measures implemented in the last decades and before are:

Progressive Taxation
Welfare Programs
Regulation and general Gov intervention and interference....

Which regulations were you referring to? What general government interventions and interference are you referring to?

I'm not trying to be tiresome. I'm just trying to understand your position.

By government interventions and interference, do you include things like:

• Antitrust legislation?
• How about food safety standards? Is inspection of meat socialism?
• What about regulations specifying what side of the road we drive down and highway safety standards?
• How about conflict-of-interest regulations for the banking industry?
• Do you feel government intervention to prevent insider trading to be socialism?
• Do you think antitrust regulations are socialist overreaching?
• How about environmental regulations? Do you think it is socialistic to require power plants not to belch unseemly amounts of sulfer, carbon monoxide, carbon dioxide, and other pollutants into the air?
• How about child safety and welfare regulations? Are they an unwarranted interference in the business decisions of day-care centers, schools, toy manufacturers?

I do wish to respond to your position, but I'd like to be clearer on exactly what it is.

I get the part where you think progressive taxation and various welfare programs are socialist.


Regards,

Alan OldStudent

[Andy62]

Let me just chime in with some personal insights having been in the real esate and investment business for over 40 years. My experience was that the bureauacrats in the government put in programs some of which were meant to help people and many to play up to their constituent bases. They would come up with these social engineering type programs that looked good on paper,but they weren't familiar with the businesses and didn't know the nuts and bolts where "the rubber hit the road". These programs all had flaws in them that the people that had a working a knowledge of the businesses knew. In every activity there is knowledge and "the game" that consists of taking the activity above the lower level of "quantitative understanding" and to a higher level of "conceptual thinking" which very few people in any activity, even highly educated ones, understand. Right brain beats left brain. Game theory involves using psychology, leverages,and not so obvious factors to circumvent people who don't know the game. In real estate in particular things such as lien and title laws can be played in a variety of ways that are not obvious. Napoleon Bonaparte said,"Imagination rules the world" and Albert Einstein said"Imagination is more important than knowledge." One of the most obvious and effective ways to circumvent regulators is to go directly to the legislators themselves and put pressure on them with the help one of the 35,000 lobbyists in DC. If you think all of the good guys are in the white hats and on one side and all of the bad guys are in the black hats on the other side as a lot of people do you are kidding yourself, The Bush adminstration in 2003 sent out warnings too Congress that the housing market was overbuilt and tried to reform Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac,but Barney Frank and others insisted that there was no housing crisis. I heard it mentioned today that Wall Street Interests were among the biggest backers of Obama. You can't tell the players without a score card or until you know "the game" and figure out their MO.

[Andy62]

http://www.sodahead.com/blog/29077/f...ie-maefreddie/